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Sat Dec 09, 2017 4:14 pm by andy-kaz

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Sun Dec 03, 2017 12:44 pm by andy-kaz

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Sun Nov 19, 2017 7:34 pm by Gary M Jones

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Orme gliding Insurance

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Orme gliding Insurance

Post by Tim on Mon Jan 05, 2015 1:48 pm

We are still getting large numbers attending the glider sessions at the orme. As with any RC model flying - at any site in the UK - participating without holding valid insurance is at best irresponsible and at worst extremely risky to both the uninsured pilot and the continued use of the site. The gt orme is no exception and long standing and regular users of this superb site do so only with the co-operation of Conwy County council, Mostyn estates, and the countryside commission. As a local flyer on this site, I confirm with these authorities - each year - that all visiting flyers are properly insured. Could I ask any fellow club members to ask to see proof of insurance from other flyers if you meet them. Obviously, fully paid up members of RDMFC will be insured via BMFA .
Cheers guys.

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Re: Orme gliding Insurance

Post by Allan Patrick on Mon Jan 05, 2015 4:59 pm

What do the byelaws state?
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Re: Orme gliding Insurance

Post by Tim on Mon Jan 05, 2015 6:23 pm

Not sure, and TBH not really that interested - all I know is that any or all of the authorities involved will be very unhappy to say the least if an incident involving property / people damage was to occur and the pilot involved was not insured against such a risk.
Imagine the negative publicity and legal wranglings that would occur should a model - for example - cause a motor vehicle accident on the cliff-side marine drive road, or hit a dog walker etc. One certain outcome would be the authorities imposing an immediate ban on model aircraft flying in an area frequented by "uncontrolled" members of the public.
I for one would be VERY unhappy if I was no longer able to use this national treasure of a slope site which has been a popular venue for many many years.
Its simple...... we responsible flyers politely check that all flyers are insured just as we would at our own club power site.

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Re: Orme gliding Insurance

Post by Allan Patrick on Mon Jan 05, 2015 7:21 pm

Personally, with a car park just downwind of the most usual flying spot, and having seen planes come down in it, I think it would be quite stupid not to have insurance!
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Re: Orme gliding Insurance

Post by andy-kaz on Mon Jan 05, 2015 7:24 pm

then refrain from crashing models in a carpark would be the most practical idea
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Re: Orme gliding Insurance

Post by Allan Patrick on Mon Jan 05, 2015 7:33 pm

If it was my car you hadn't refrained from crashing onto then I'm sure you could be sure of a financial crash!
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Re: Orme gliding Insurance

Post by andy-kaz on Mon Jan 05, 2015 7:39 pm

but I wouldn't crash into your car in the first place hopefully.... but im a bit bewildered as to how all of a sudden this issue has raised its head
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Re: Orme gliding Insurance

Post by Mark Barnes on Mon Jan 05, 2015 7:41 pm

Pretty sensible idea to check really
Ive used the orme for over 12 years and many locals and members for much longer seems only right the "locals" should want to protect our spot.

I will add to my intoductions when im up there

I imagine the issue has come up as its the time of the year insurance is due and there was some 10 models.in the air at one point yesterday.

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Re: Orme gliding Insurance

Post by Mark Barnes on Mon Jan 05, 2015 7:42 pm

With no one checking insurance

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Re: Orme gliding Insurance

Post by Allan Patrick on Mon Jan 05, 2015 7:45 pm

Uninsured people flying in public places, inc the Orme, is always a hot topic

Since all paid up RDMFC members are insured we can rest easy
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Re: Orme gliding Insurance

Post by andy-kaz on Mon Jan 05, 2015 7:47 pm

Good job I was insured then when I was last up there....
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Re: Orme gliding Insurance

Post by Allan Patrick on Mon Jan 05, 2015 7:56 pm

Who are you insured with since, I think, you're not now a club member?
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Re: Orme gliding Insurance

Post by andy-kaz on Mon Jan 05, 2015 8:00 pm

im not insured by anybody right now but I was when I went up the Orme
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Re: Orme gliding Insurance

Post by Tim on Mon Jan 05, 2015 8:06 pm

andy-kaz wrote:but I wouldn't crash into your car in the first place hopefully.... but im a bit bewildered as to how all of a sudden this issue has raised its head

Hi Andy and happy new year mate.

Come come now...... "hoping" to not crash or have an incident is hardly a sensible line of defence is it? I hope to never have a crash or incident in my car, and hope that the roof tiles don't ever blow off my house and cause damage but that doesn't stop me having insurance - presumably you do have car and home insurance ?

As Mark says, this is the time of year that insurance is renewed, and the orme gets a lot of visitors in the winter due to weather conditions so it was discussed amongst a few of us yesterday whilst on the slope ;-)

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Re: Orme gliding Insurance

Post by Brian Colclough on Mon Jan 05, 2015 8:12 pm

I'm sorry but if the powers that be (Conwy Council, Mostyn Estates uncle Tom Cobbly and all) want the insurance situation policed then they should at the very least post some notices saying that the wardens (assuming there still are some) can check said insurance randomly and not leave it to local individuals to play the fun police roll no matter how well intentioned. The thing is people from all over use the site at all times of the day and week why the hell should we locals be held to account for any misdemeanours they commit in the absence of said insurance. In no way would I want to see the loss of this great facility but think this is a piss poor solution to what is an insolvable problem if some nutter wants to go fly uninsured up there.For sure you can ask people for proof of insurance but what do you do if they tell you to suck off ?

P.S Don't say kneel down


Last edited by Brian Colclough on Mon Jan 05, 2015 8:16 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Orme gliding Insurance

Post by Tim on Mon Jan 05, 2015 8:15 pm

andy-kaz wrote:im not insured by anybody right now but I was when I went up the Orme

andy-kaz wrote:there was plenty of wind and lift on the other slope facing Conwy earlier this morning..

Posted yesterday, Sunday the 4th Jan 2015 - so did you fly then Andy? - as you had obviously left before I arrived mid afternoon.
If so, may I respectfully ask which insurance did you operate under as according to the latest list you haven't rejoined RDMFC yet?
Feel free to PM me if you prefer.


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Re: Orme gliding Insurance

Post by Mark Barnes on Mon Jan 05, 2015 8:17 pm

Locals would be quilty by assosiation. Like quad fliers.

Dont see why people would not want to try and protect the flying site to be honest

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Re: Orme gliding Insurance

Post by andy-kaz on Mon Jan 05, 2015 8:26 pm

nope... I went up there in the morning around 11am to go have a look up there, wind direction was coming the wrong side but I noticed other modellers cars parked up ie the Manchester boys... so myself and the mrs had a walk round to the bowl or whatever ya call it and had a chat with them... is this why the discussion has started over aswell as discussing yesterday on the Orme??
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Re: Orme gliding Insurance

Post by Tim on Mon Jan 05, 2015 8:26 pm

Im not offering it as a solution Brian ( HNY by the way Smile ) - and of course, just as yourself and other flyers I personally have no "authority" at all to "police" it. However, I do have a personal interest in trying to ensure that any flyers attending the site do so insured, as that at least shows a sense of responsibility and would certainly prove beneficial in the event of any incident. I'm merely asking that local regular attendees politely ask visiting flyers if they are insured. I regularly ask any flyers who I don't personally know, and when I'm there as part of the PSSA make a habit of checking visiting flyers, as requested and agreed by Phil Cooke who is chairman of the PSSA. I have never yet experienced confrontation or refusal to chat, in fact quite the opposite - fellow flyers are grateful that a sense of responsibility is being shown by the majority of people there. I find that if people are approached in a friendly and polite way, then they almost always have no problem discussing things.

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Re: Orme gliding Insurance

Post by Brian Colclough on Mon Jan 05, 2015 8:35 pm

HNY to you Tim, I appreciate we all have a vested interest here and get your drift totally. Can I just ask do you actually liaise personally with CBC and Mostyn Estates personally on this matter on a regular basis ?

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Re: Orme gliding Insurance

Post by Tim on Mon Jan 05, 2015 8:35 pm

OK thanks Andy Smile
As has already been stated, the discussions I had yesterday with several of the regulars was the catalyst for my post. Things are often "thought about" by people and frequently discussed covertly but few folk are happy to poke their head above the parapet and actually say anything publicly. No individual names or people were mentioned yesterday ( not to me anyway ) it was merely talked about over a cup of coffee - in fact a visiting flyer was the one who asked me in the first place.
As I have already said, its simple really - if you are concerned about preserving the freedom and relaxed atmosphere of flying on the Orme, and have concerns about anyone operating without proper valid insurance, then introduce yourself and have a friendly chat. Simples.
Im not asking or expecting anyone to get involved in heated discussions or arguments, if that brews..... then my advice is to walk away - and make the incident known to other locals.

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Re: Orme gliding Insurance

Post by Tim on Mon Jan 05, 2015 8:46 pm

Brian Colclough wrote:HNY to you Tim, I appreciate we all have a vested interest here and get your drift totally. Can I just ask do you actually liaise personally with CBC and Mostyn Estates personally on this matter on a regular basis ?

The matter of insurance - No. However I do regularly liaise with CBC regarding organized events such as the PSSA weekends. I check for road closures etc and inform them via the local tourist information office ( for whom I now work officially on a part time basis ) of upcoming events. To date I have never received anything but positive comments about our activities - indeed CBC even liaised with local press and councillors over the last few years to arrange extra publicity and press coverage and the amount of interested public who attended the events was well up on previous years. During one such discussion a year or two back I was asked if the flyers were "professional" and I replied accordingly, but did stress that they were all qualified within their representative body ( BMFA ) to fly and also carried recognized 3rd party insurance.

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Re: Orme gliding Insurance

Post by andy-kaz on Mon Jan 05, 2015 8:49 pm

a
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Re: Orme gliding Insurance

Post by andy-kaz on Mon Jan 05, 2015 8:51 pm

im not insured or a fully fledged club member as im skint after the Christmas period.. and having to wait 6 weeks before next pay packet is quite along time to wait. could the club do some sort of monthly payment pack direct debit as im pretty sure there are other clubs out there that do this???
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Re: Orme gliding Insurance

Post by Tim on Mon Jan 05, 2015 8:53 pm

OT mate.

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